The Third Reich rising in the Democratic Party ? with poll.

greg, you can always go back and peep at it.

straw horse argument, easy to knock down: the governor threatened to fire union employees when he said cooperate or be layed off - layoffs can be temporary (furloughs) or could become permanent; sticking to the ranting point that layoffs can only mean "fired" is one way to commentary on this topic

what people want is fairness in terms of economic sacrifices (ultimatum directed at unions didn't favor some unions over others and didn't involve stripping the employees of the right to unionize); the state electorate will remember very well by the next gubernatorial election whether or which efforts had more negative impact on everyday people or on the wealthy and will vote accordingly, so, no liberals do not have selective amnesia or any amnesia

I genuinely wish that people would engage in conversations verbally or in print that did not rely on the use of inflammatory rhetoric to score points because it's divisive which is probably the point after all [shaking my head in disgust]

To Happy whose post contained, "I genuinely wish that people would engage in conversations verbally or in print that did not rely on the use of inflammatory rhetoric to score points because it's divisive which is probably the point after all [shaking my head in disgust]"

Oh, like this one? "Why yes it does sound familiar. It's exactly what the Repukes have been doing." (1.11 - Emphasis mine)

I agree, engaging in immature elementary school and middle school playground taunts never improves one's credibility. Actually, name-calling in schools across the nation is now known as bullying, and engaging in that sort of behavior is punishable by law.

And I don't see where he forced concessions AND eliminated collective bargaining...

Nor did Cuomo give massive tax cuts to corporations, but I doubt that those differences, significant as they are, will matter here.

They should be doing a rally for Cuomo!

Can you imagine. Only problem is Cuomo would call out the state police to shut down his own rally !

WandaGerschwitz / greg

"And the Teaparty didn't lift a finger on this one. They should be doing a rally for Cuomo!"

Ya know....you're right! Where the heck IS the Tea Party on this? Maybe Cuomo's (D) is keeping them silent. Maybe FreidomWerks and the well known Dick Armey haven't recieved funding and/or marching orders from the Koch Bros.

The Tea Party's silence makes them seem like an astro-turf group, paid to show up only when corporate profits and policies are at stake. Hmmmmm.........

"

"Maybe Cuomo's policy keeps them quiet! Hmmmmm."

So...... the Tea Party shows support by silence? If so, then everything they do not speak out on, they support. By silence.

Oh...Good point greg.

greg

Hey...you're the one that put forth the idea that the Tea Party supports cuomo by NOT protesting his actions, so don't try to lay that on me.

Childish or not, that was your suggestion, not mine. In any case, I believe this all just reinforces my contention that the point you've tried to make in your article doesn't hold water.

Brawny paper towels for everyone !

Brawny paper towels for everyone !

Meh i like Bounty the quicker picker upper. Sounds like a tag line for a prostitute............

I go with Bounty myself. Rosie was a smart gal:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4MjFb6r1BE&feature=related

"Never to old to learn" and "Never too young!" -- The USA needs more of this thinking in all future elections. Cuomo's neighboring governor, Chris Christie, has gotten hammered daily by the media, liberal politicians, and unions for his fiscal responsibility and calling to task corruption and bloated (exec) salaries ... but we hear only crickets from NY? Hmmm.

"Brawny paper towels for everyone !"

"I go with Bounty myself."

" The USA needs more of this thinking in all future elections."

Wow. I've never read comments that reflected the tenacious hold corporate culture has on some folks.

Promoting a brand of paper towels because a large politically conservative corporation owns them?

Apparently, paper towels aren't the only thing the Koch Bros. own.

@AZPADDY (6.5) --- I didn't know that fun had been outlawed on Newsvine. Please, lighten up a little ... you'll live longer! :)

"Lighten up"? I thought what I said was downright funny!

I guess it is hard to tell the intent of a comment sometimes, but ya gotta admit, promoting paper towels because liberals just might not like the brand is a pretty weird way to selct paper towels, wouldn't you say?

Gerg

Omg say it isnt so your supporting a Dem the worlds gone mad i tell you mad.............

Actually he is being supported for doing the right thing being dem or anything else has nothing to do with it but the left only thinks they know what is best. The rep all over the country are doing the same thing but the left wants to demonize them at any chance they get.

Good morning!!!!

I subscribe to the school of thought that "conservative right is wrong", and that opinion is based on solid economic fact, as the records of past administrations reflect.

Good morning.

Nice catch MWeaver. That should be looked into further.

LOL, what a post

That's the difference between smart, reasonable, realistic proposals, and the mentally-disturbed and clinically insane nonsense we've seen out of the right.

Uh hum...sure. That is the exact kind of rhetoric that git your party kicked to the curb last Nov. Try a bit harder next time to at least attempt to be civil rather than trying to paint with such broad strokes.

Cuomo actually listens to both sides before legislating, the way a RESPONSIBLE leader should. We all know the GOP and Tea Party are in very short supply of responsible leaders

Really? Is that why the Fleebaggers ran from WI? And that doesn't square up with this:

http://media.hotair.com/archives/2011/03/09/walker-offers-compromise-fleebaggers-walk-away/

or here

UPDATE II: Wisconsin Senate Majority Leader Scott Fitzgerald has reportedly negotiated with several truant Democrats face-to-face...along the Illinois/Wisconsin border.

@news3jessica: Sen Fitzgerald says he met in person at the state line with some Sen Democrats about possible return.

Very reasonable response and analysis Matt Rock. Methodology is often the difference between a good administrator and a poor one.

That is the exact kind of rhetoric that git your party kicked to the curb last Nov.

You can't look at the polling numbers and still say that with a straight face. We lost in November because no one took the mid-terms, the Tea Party, or the GOP seriously. 2012 isn't going to be a midterm. Here's a video link that can help the GOP/ Tea Party prepare for what's going to happen in November 2012.

Walker made demands to the unions. The unions caved, but Walker wasn't satisfied, and decided to kick them while they were down. The American people are furious about this nonsense (even right-leaning polls are showing that), and every time someone on the right insults a teacher or a fire fighter, they're digging the hole that much deeper. So keep supporting Walker, keep bashing public unions, and keep insulting public servants. But in the 2012 elections, do be sure to remember to duck and cover.

Matt, I agreed with what you said earlier. I still agree.

Do you realize how difficult it can be to get past all of the unnecessary adjective use presented in a chin stuck out manner and understand your point?

It is this tendency to constantly have to display the ability to write strident phrases and constantly end up in a "SO THERE" posture that hurt the liberals in the last election. Just a minute now, the smart thing for the right to do would be to encourage the left to maintain this style. It is the aura of combat and narcissism that is destroying the Democratic Part.

The Republican party is imploding in one fashion and the Democrats in another. If you really want to be listened to, leave the smugness behind.

I agree.

Germany's far-right National Democratic party (NPD) has triggered outrage with plans for a Third Reich-style "training centre" in a small village.

The mastermind of the scheme is Jürgen Rieger, a lawyer and deputy leader of the anti-immigrant, anti-EU party that is steeped in pride for Adolf Hitler and the "achievements" of the Nazi regime. The idea is for the old Hotel Gerhus at Fassberg, near Hanover, to become a place of pilgrimage for NPD devotees, where they can learn about the "menace" of immigration, the "criminality" of Roma gypsies and the "innate decency of law-abiding German nationalists".

Mr Rieger, 61, has also tried to open Boys From Brazil-style "breeding centres" in other locations; the plan being for all white, Ayran racists like himself to produce offspring to people the Fourth Reich, which he believes is coming one day.

The abandoned hotel went into receivership 24 hours before Mr Rieger signed a 10-year lease on it with the debt-ridden owners. The receiver, Jens Wilhelm, had hoped to be granted an order this week to force the neo-Nazis off the property, but a court rejected his move. It means Mr Rieger and the NPD are there until another court hearing can be convened.

His refusal to give up his plan is likely to cause a furore in Fassberg. Left-wing, anti-Nazi groups are already promising marches that would inevitably lead to violence near the 80-room property.

A foretaste came at the weekend when shots were fired near the hotel and young people from the left and right faced off with pepper sprays and batons. Police have mobilised 24-hour patrol.

Interesting indeed.

Did he ever say he was a liberal?

owlsview - leave it to you to put things into perspective. LOL!

I didn't say that is what your article says. But it does attempt to take democrats and progressives to the woodshed on hypocrisy. In order to do that, you have to assume that democrats are lock step on a certain set of solutions to budget problems - raising revenue through taxes and fees - and were mute through the NY budget process solely because the new governor is a democrat.

Democrats were not mute and there were protests. The budget had bipartisan support as each branch of the legislature is controlled by a different party There were huge differences in the way Cuomo handled the budget relative to Scott Walker & John Kasich.

When you get down to it, none of the implied assumptions that support your stated perspective are correct.

At least you got that part right!

Get it, RIGHT!

18.3 post later and I just got it, you're right!

I thought they just read the headline and started ranting...

Get it, RIGHT

LOL!!

Ooooooo, all caps and exclamation points. Prima facie evidence of an intellectual bankrupt and specious perspective.

But your attempt to call hypocrisy is a massive fail, Greg, as the reaction of progressives has not been hypocritical - they have protested. Further, Cuomo didn't do anything close to rescinding the collective bargaining rights of public workers. I read your entire article and your umbrage rests on nonsense. This is certainly acceptable for a circle-jerk of republibaggerservative, but that doesn't make it truth.

You do have great potential, though. Perhaps FauxNews is hiring.

Well said Dwillie. The whole article rests on this false notion that because Cuomo was tough on unions and cut spending that he is no different than Walker, and that simply is not true.

Walker was never really interested in pay cuts, because the unions conceded the pay issue and Walker still pressed on.

They are not the same. Walker's goal was to break the union, something that Cuomo never entertained.

I'll say it again, the issue in WI was union busting. Did Cuomo bust the union, or is still there? It's still there, because Cuomo never even considered union busting. End of alleged similarity.

As a result of Walker's scorched Earth tactics, his poll numbers have plummeted, and they are desperate to rehab his image so that it doesn't drag down the entire party. I expect to see more articles proclaiming that Walker is being unfairly portrayed by the left.

I thought the name of this site was Newsvine, not Propaganda vine. If it's hypocrisy that you're really after, there is plenty in both parties without having to twist around what Cuomo has done.

republibaggerservative

Prima facie evidence of an intellectual bankrupt and specious perspective.

Ahh...the irony.

It doesn't look like irony to me. It looks like merleliz doesn't have an intelligent rebuttal to the truth.

Ahh, more irrelevancies from the vine host. Your so-called "list" only remotely mimics republican actions because it prevaricates through omission. Every state is dealing with the same macro issue of budget deficits and the options for dealing with them are limited. The absurdity you're attempting to advance is similar to saying that gangbangers and police officers should be viewed the same because they both occasionally shoot firearms.

Is comprehension just null and void anymore.

If that is a question (there is usually a question mark at the end), I'm sure your mirror is a far better place for you to ask it.

Funny how we keep hearing, "Republicans are the Third Reich re-incarnated",

We do? The word "keep" connotes a frequency that you have yet to confirm with evidence. Perhaps you simply revel in hyperbole. But even going down this vacuous path reveals the intellectual bankruptcy of your premise as any alleged analogies to fascism likely has far more to do with republibaggerservative attempts to legislate where, when, how and to whom we pray, who we can love or marry, what decisions a woman should make about her health and reproductive options. It likely has to do as well with the absurd assertions over who is a "Real American", admonishments to be "armed and dangerous" and to "not retreat, reload". Perhaps it was senate republicans embracing the notion that the President's failure in addressing America's needs was a good thing for them. Or the use of Joseph Goebbel's tactics of mendacity (I.e. Death Panels) through the willing propaganda army that is FauxNews. There are at least 50 things that republibaggerservatives have done over the last two years that justify the "Third Reich" analogy. Attempting to balance a budget isn't one of them.

This article is a massive fail. You've made no argument that compels any different a view.

The vine host's penchant for all caps, exclamation points, personal insults and threatening language serves as testimony to the vacuity of the perspectives expressed in the article. I'm sure that a balanced budget solely through spending cuts gets a broad thumbs up. But the insinuation that democrats are supposed to burn Cuomo in effigy for doing so is simply nonsense. The author has presented nothing to the contrary that any thinking person could find compelling to his thesis.

dwillie

Not everyone can work "vacuity" into a post on the NV, good job

I may have look at this on a more macro level than you, bu I took the article to portray and Gov Cuomo (a Democrat) was taking many of the same steps to balance his budget that Republican governors were taking (and being vilified and demonized for) in other states.

I further think it was meant to portray that contrary to previous reports all the Blue Dogs are not dead and gone.

I think Governor Cuomo's fiscal conservatism is going to make hi a major player on the national scene in 2016, but I am an independent so what do I know

Take care

Greetings Robert.

If the article were limited to what you explained, I would have no problem with it. You bring up a compelling point about presidential aspirations and if Cuomo can produce five more balanced budgets sans tax increases, he will clearly make himself highly competitive in a general election. He will still have to get through the democratic primaries so he won't be able continue to govern against core democratic constituencies. That said, both he and Bloomberg could be positioning themselves for independent/third party street cred. I for one think the more parties the better as it would encourage more coalition government, potentially minimizing the kind of nonsense we're seeing in Washington this week. But that for another time.

While I believe the macro view worthwhile to consider, I take issue with what i see to be the "Nyah, Nyah, Nyah" finger wagging, particularly when the particulars of the underlying thesis don't add up. Cuomo isn't attempting to eliminate collective bargaining - the primary driver of massive protests in Wisconsin and Ohio. Walker hasnt been pilloried (sp?) for wage or benefit concessions as the union was already willing to give those up. Further, the assertion that traditionally democratic constituencies have been hypocritically silent even on the benefits and other concessions Cuomo demanded is simply not true. I thus view the angle take by the article to be both unnecessary, gratuitous and mendacious relative to the complete set of facts.

I know you well enough, Greg, by your posts. Your posts clearly attempt to force others into acceptance of your point of view through any number of juvenile tactics. Insults, all caps and exclamation points (the forum equivalent of shouting) and veiled threats. If you decided to actually adhere to the CoH, you would literally have to delete your own posts. I've already stated what I think of such playground bluster so there is no need to repeat.

I know all I need to know about you Greg.

Yes, I do, I'm not wrong, and I understand the article and your point perfectly. Robert correctly explained the portion of your article (infinitely better than you) about which I don't disagree. But you clearly overreached to make a statement about democrats in general, ignoring important details that didn't support your thesis.

I don't need to know anything more about you other than what you have communicated in your posts as they speak volumes.

We all have the ability to write what we want within the bounds of the CoH, though you as moderator have clearly exercised your own discretion in ignoring it. I for one will not be bullied into agreement with nonsensical tripe regardless of the number off exclamation points, all cap words or insults you use in your clearly misguided attempt to compel it.

Your article got this pile of poo roling downhill, Greg.

dwillie

I think you are dead wrong about Cuomo and a third party run, he was a Democrat at birth and will be a Democrat at his passing; pure bloodlines and loyalty and support from the pillars of the Democratic Party.

Tehre will be no third party run by Cuomo, never happen not a chance.

I did not say, and neither did Greg really , that Cuomo was using the same tactics as the GOP Governors I mentioned, I merely said that he was doing exactly the same thing and that in my view is the point.

Thanks for the feedback and though it is none of my business I think you may be looking for a fight (in a debating sense) where there is none here

Take good care

Perhaps Cuomo and a third party run is a stretch. But then he would clearly have to get his support from a centrist democrat/independent voter if he is to continue the path he is on with the progressive base. I wonder if he has done that math.

I think that someone writing an article implying hypocrisy among traditionally democratic constituencies is the one looking for a fight, Robert. Beginning with a specious, strawman statement:

Funny how we keep hearing, "Republicans are the Third Reich re-incarnated", because of their policy proposals.

The writer is clearly manufacturing a point with the objective to deride. Further, the writer puts quotation marks around a statement as if someone has actually said it. Also, the writer says "Funny how we keep hearing...." as if someone is leveling the charge at republicans every day. Of course, no support is provided for these assertions.

Who has said that republicans are the Third Reich reincarnated? Even if someone has, how often does this happen in reality? If the pejorative is ever leveled, how often is it leveled at anyone wrestling with the clear challenges of budgetary stress vs. other situations (rights of LGBT, reproductive rights, voting, religious freedom, etc.)? In my view, Cuomo is doing what every governor is required to do - make tough choices based on the particular needs of their respective states. Illinois governor Quinn (a democrat) announced $1.0 billion in budget cuts for FY 2010 and another $1.4 billion in cuts for FY2011. These cuts have been met with protests as well.

The article makes several blanket assertions that are clearly wrong or unsupported:

1. Cuomo is doing things that republicans are doing. This is incomplete. He's doing things that governors of both political stripes are doing.
2. Republicans are considered the "reincarnation of the Third Reich" for their approach to the budget. This is a completely unsupported and specious assertion.
3. Democrats hypocritically are not castigating Cuomo for his approach to the budget. Wrong. The budget decisions were protested and they were covered by media.

He also prevaricates by omission, ignoring the fact that the visceral reaction of union members and progressives in Wisconsin and Ohio had nothing to do with budget cuts and demands for benefit concessions. The anger in both those states were over the rescinding of collective bargaining rights, something that Cuomo did not do.

The writer of the article made assertions worthy of criticism and disdain. He played fast and loose with facts in order to support spurrious aspersions only to take umbrage when anyone has the temerity not to simply accept those aspersions. If he wasn't looking for a fight, then he should have written the article straight ahead, without the braindead

Dwillie,

Again you are dead on the money with your articulate and highly accurate posts.

The article is based upon a false analogy, used to support accusations that could not stand on their own otherwise, and you have pointed that out very well. However, the author of this article seems to be much too proud of his work to admit any factual weaknesses in it, or his posts supporting it, even though both have been pointed out very clearly by you and others. The author can deny all he likes that he is comparing Cuomo to Walker, but it just doesn't wash. And Cuomo, once again, or as Greg would state....s l o w l y. . . did not threaten to remove the collective bargaining status of any unions.

When confronted with the fact that Cuomo was different because he did not bust any unions, Greg insists that Cuomo did engage in union busting in one of his firsts posts on that issue.

The author states in post 1.5 ..... It's call union busting!!!!!

Then, in order not to concede any points, in post #18.11 he denies that he's making any comparisons to Walker....

@ Moo:

The whole article rests on this false notion that because Cuomo was tough on unions and cut spending that he is no different than Walker, and that simply is not true.

Is comprehension just null and void anymore. There is nothing in the article that claims Cuomo was equal to Walker. The claim in the article IS, and I'll go slow for you:

Funny how we keep hearing, "Republicans are the Third Reich re-incarnated", because of their policy proposals.

T-H-E-N, It goes through a list of accomplishments by Cuomo, which mimics exactly what the R-E-P-U-B-L-I-C-A-N-S are doing that Liberals Hate.

The author repeatedly disavows any comparison of Cuomo to Gov Walker, insisting that he is only contrasting the GOP and Cuomo. Yet he twice mentions Cuomo and his recent taslk with the unions. The author is being silly at best, and disingenous at worst. At any rate, I can't take such behavior seriously. If the author wants to be taken seriously by anyone besides rabidly partison cheerleaders he's going to have to stop insulting the intelligence of his readers, that is unless rabidly partison cheerleaders are the only audience he cares to engage.

And we sure need more like him.

my pockets

We need more like him in both parties

R & D That would be to much research and not enough development.

I am not sure, at my age what used to mean Rock & Roll now means Rock&Remember.

At my age it means Rest and Recover.

So we tax the rich and give it to the rich in Congress to spend. Throwing good money after bad is one of those things considered irresponsible. Wouldn't solve a thing, just encourage more money to leave our shores.